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The Ecology of the Shedim

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Rift_0f_Bladz

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« Reply #75 on: <01-22-16/1639:39> »
Sounds like I need to find the "Care Bear" horror thread.

Second, while yes the worse a Shedim can do to you (and you alone) is kill you, but no one lives in a vacuum. Master Shedim instead corrupt other gullible humans into making Hitler and his camps look like a summer camp for kids. Why, yes (insert believe system/political group/book club) into committing mass genocide. Better yet, the could currupt a summer camp for kids into making the kids crazed killers, only for them to in the final act commit suicide. So, yup, just mltotally misunderstood. Kinda like Pinhead (or any other Evil outsider) he really was just wanting a friend.
Quote- Mirikon on 7/30/2019 at 08:26:51
Agreed. This looks like a 'training wheels' edition, that you can use to introduce someone to the setting, and then shift over to something like 5E or 4E. Like how D&D 5E is best used as training wheels for D&D 3.X.

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CitizenJoe

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« Reply #76 on: <01-22-16/1725:09> »
I noticed that you just implied the best Shedim can do is imitate Man, i.e. Hitler.   

MijRai

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« Reply #77 on: <01-22-16/1843:54> »
Actually, if they implied anything it is that Shedim would be worse. 
Would you want to go into a place where the resident had a drum-fed shotgun and can see in the dark?

PiXeL01

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« Reply #78 on: <01-23-16/0110:06> »
Hitter and any other dictator discriminated in their killings. The Shedim don't. They want to extinguish all life. That is their sole purpose. They have no other motive at all. They don't do it out of necessity, they didn't come here to breed or as fugitives. They came to destroy. There aren't any shades of gray to find in them because it's blacker than the void already.
We humans kill to promote our tribes, for greed, for our legacy. Shedim do not. There is nothing on this plane of existence worse than the Shedim. There is no reasoning, no bargaining, no negotiating. They want you dead, period.

They want all life gone simply because life exists here. That is all.
« Last Edit: <01-23-16/0236:43> by PiXeL01 »
If Tom Brady’s a Spike Baby, what does that make Brees and Rodgers?

The Wyrm Ouroboros

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« Reply #79 on: <01-23-16/0124:01> »
Enh.  Joe's angling around to mousetrap people; ignore the guy.  Yes, people are very, very bad; just reading the bit about the Shedim in the Threats 2 book shows you how malevolent they are.  And yes, Joe, people are bad, and you can have a lot of 'fun' playing around with this, but even people who ... actually, about half your examples are inaccurate, but whatever.  They still love their kids, and want to play baseball or tennis, and have a good meal with friends, etc.

Shedim don't.  No matter what your crazy argument happens to be, it's canon that shedim simply don't want to have a good meal with friends, or love their kids, or want to play baseball or tennis, or the ten billion other dreams that people want.  Shedim want to kill you.  And your kids.  And your friends.  And good meals.  And tennis.  And especially baseball.

Sooooo ...

Pix - 'extinguish'.
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PiXeL01

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« Reply #80 on: <01-23-16/0232:42> »
Fixing it. Thanks.
If Tom Brady’s a Spike Baby, what does that make Brees and Rodgers?

Reaver

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« Reply #81 on: <01-23-16/0451:06> »
Was that 6 pages or only 5 before Godwin's Law was applied?
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The Wyrm Ouroboros

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« Reply #82 on: <01-23-16/0510:09> »
At least it's a viable comparison.  :P
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Mirikon

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« Reply #83 on: <01-23-16/1039:13> »
I don't think Godwin really applies when it is a legit comparison, though. That's like being surprised that the Yankees come up in a discussion about New York City sports teams.
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Moonshine Fox

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« Reply #84 on: <01-23-16/1135:48> »
Was that 6 pages or only 5 before Godwin's Law was applied?

Just over 5, and it was only a minor representation of the Law. Not bad I'd say.

CitizenJoe

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« Reply #85 on: <01-23-16/1232:02> »
Fundamentally,  Shedim are zombies.  They exist to be guilt free victims of our characters' murder fantasies.  They are Synths, body snatchers, evil clones, doppelgangers... whatever the flavor, they are cast as irredeemably evil creatures who look just like us so that we have an excuse to go on a rampage. 

If that's your kick, fine.  But, I like the guilt and anguish and repercussions involved with pulling that trigger.  That is why I prefer Shadowrun over DND.  Absolute evil undermines the responsibility.

Reaver

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« Reply #86 on: <01-23-16/1239:24> »
And some of us shoot schoolgirls in the face for a paycheck..... So 'moral' arguments are lost on us.
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« Reply #87 on: <01-23-16/1306:06> »
And some of us shoot schoolgirls in the face for a paycheck..... So 'moral' arguments are lost on us.
in your neighbourhood they might...

In ours, you find the GrrlScouts tend to shoot back, if they aren't shooting first. :P

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MijRai

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« Reply #88 on: <01-23-16/1354:40> »
Fundamentally, Shedim are worse than zombies.  Zombies aren't malevolent, they're generally unthinking.  The fear invoked by zombies is that they don't actually care; if they could be said to have a goal, it is to consume, to propagate.  They take a person, hurt them, make the person one of them.  To make you one of them, until all are them. 

Shedim, like it is explicitly stated, don't care about that.  The body is only a tool they use to get to their real goal; the destruction of all things living.  Theirs is an emotionally fueled hatred.  It's personal to them.  Comparing them to Synths and clones is ludicrous; Synths might be used for infiltration, but how many of them just want freedom and rights? 

Shedim exist as one of the few 'evil' things in Shadowrun (Blood Spirits might be up there too, and some forms of Shadow Spirits as well).  Two or three things out of innumerable options.  It is really hard to have shades of gray without some black and white to define it.  You don't find that black and white in metahumanity or nature, generally.  Shedim take up the slack, as that is what they are. 

In the end, if you want your characters to constantly feel guilt and remorse...  Don't use the Shedim.  Their purpose isn't to make you feel remorse, just like you generally shouldn't feel remorse for squishing a Queen Bug.  Their purpose is to evoke fear and terror, to thrash the PCs when possible, to try and possess the mage's body and cause havoc.  If Shedim are in your game, you've got bigger things to worry about than crying over the body you just beat, slashed and stabbed until it could no longer attack you. 
Would you want to go into a place where the resident had a drum-fed shotgun and can see in the dark?

Moonshine Fox

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« Reply #89 on: <01-23-16/1513:39> »
It makes me wonder though, with Shedim being in the pure evil at the end of the scale, is there anything in Shadowrun that we know about that takes up the pure good side of the spectrum?

 

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