[Stainless Steel Devil Rat]

...

2) Why is there no cap on extreme range? At face value this doesn't seem like an issue, until a savvy Decker or Rigger starts launching guided missiles from kilometers away using matrix signatures or scouting drones to pick targets. You could pretty easily turn a truck into an MLRS at chargen (173,000¥ for a Toyota Gopher with 2 Heavy weapon Mounts, 2 Onotari Interceptors, and 24 Rating 6 Guided Missiles... or go balls out and drop 380,000¥ for a Roadmaster with 3 HWMs, 3 Interceptors, and 54 Rating 6 Guided Missiles) and ace targets in downtown Seattle from the Redmond Barrens.

"Well, technically...."

That was already true in 5e.  Missiles and Assault cannons had no effective maximum range (see sidebar, pg 204).  Being able to grease someone from 5+ kilometers away was about the only thing that an Assault Cannon could do that a Sniper Rifle couldn't.  Stupid limits- so glad they're gone.

But anyway... with regards to "maximum" ranges... like so many other ways 6we just empowers the GM to fiat certain things.  Relies upon it, actually.

[Hephaestus]

"Well, technically...."

That was already true in 5e.  Missiles and Assault cannons had no effective maximum range (see sidebar, pg 204).  Being able to grease someone from 5+ kilometers away was about the only thing that an Assault Cannon could do that a Sniper Rifle couldn't.  Stupid limits- so glad they're gone.

The range table on page 185 of the 5th ed CRB caps assault cannon and missile launcher ranges at 1500m, same as sniper rifles. The sidebar you mention was a suggestion for long-range vehicle combat, and provides no actual ranges. The 5th ed table is RAW, while the sidebar is a suggestion. In 6th, unlimited range is RAW.

EDIT:
The main difference is that to use a rocket launcher in 5th, you still had to be close enough to trigger a near-immediate response in an upscale or secure area. In 6th, I can have a salvo of 40-60 rockets in flight in one minute flat. Depending on how far the target is from me, I might have the entire missile barrage airborne before the first one hits, which would allow me to carpet bomb an area or level a building, and leave before a response could be sent out to find me.

[Stainless Steel Devil Rat]

"Well, technically...."

That was already true in 5e.  Missiles and Assault cannons had no effective maximum range (see sidebar, pg 204).  Being able to grease someone from 5+ kilometers away was about the only thing that an Assault Cannon could do that a Sniper Rifle couldn't.  Stupid limits- so glad they're gone.

The range table on page 185 of the 5th ed CRB caps assault cannon and missile launcher ranges at 1500m, same as sniper rifles. The sidebar you mention was a suggestion for long-range vehicle combat, and provides no actual ranges. The 5th ed table is RAW, while the sidebar is a suggestion. In 6th, unlimited range is RAW.

And then pg 204 goes ahead and says "you know what, that 1500m max range is total BS and only listed for convenience's sake because Shadowrunners won't usually need more than that anyway."  And since it doesn't give an actual max range, it's up to GM fiat to decree what's just too far, even for missiles/ACs.

And that's exactly what 6we does, only for ALL weapons that have the extreme range band.  Either way the player doesn't get to say "see that crater on the moon? I'm going to hit it with my missle/autocannon".  GM still gets fiat powers, in either edition.

[Hephaestus]

And then pg 204 goes ahead and says "you know what, that 1500m max range is total BS and only listed for convenience's sake because Shadowrunners won't usually need more than that anyway."  And since it doesn't give an actual max range, it's up to GM fiat to decree what's just too far, even for missiles/ACs.

And that's exactly what 6we does, only for ALL weapons that have the extreme range band.  Either way the player doesn't get to say "see that crater on the moon? I'm going to hit it with my missle/autocannon".  GM still gets fiat powers, in either edition.

I agree that the GM gets the final say (it's their world after all), but its far easier to modify from a mechanical baseline (1500m Runner-scale limit) than it is to arbitrarily pick a limit. Its way easier for me as a player to accept a GM saying, "oh, you want to take a shot at that guy 2km away? fine, but you'll be at -10 because you're past the effective range of the weapon" than it is for them to say "well, they're too far way. no dice". A good GM always lets the players try things... things just might not work out how they wanted.

[Serin_Marst]

For me, it was less an issue of the penalties for environmental modifiers, those were pretty straight forward, apply the worst category, if there was a tie apply the next penalty up, it was the mitigations.  What applies and how much and what does that make the worst category and by how much. 

Tracer ammo reduces wind and range by 1 row, but only it it's at least the second penalty row, sunglasses reduce glare by 1 but worsen lighting, ultrasound reduces visibility by 1 and ignore lighting, but only within 50m, and so on.

If i got bogged down, it was here.

[Shinobi Killfist]

Some weapons plinking from absurd ranges doesn’t work but I have 0 issues with a rigger accurately firing a guided mussels from 5 miles away. If you can get what’s needed to target it that far off good for you. No worse than a mage finding them astrally and then telling their spirit to sick em.

[Shinobi Killfist]

For me, it was less an issue of the penalties for environmental modifiers, those were pretty straight forward, apply the worst category, if there was a tie apply the next penalty up, it was the mitigations.  What applies and how much and what does that make the worst category and by how much. 

Tracer ammo reduces wind and range by 1 row, but only it it's at least the second penalty row, sunglasses reduce glare by 1 but worsen lighting, ultrasound reduces visibility by 1 and ignore lighting, but only within 50m, and so on.

If i got bogged down, it was here.

From a GM point of view I had less of a issue with that than edge. I’m awarding edge so I need to know more. In 5e I say you have -x from fog and the dude with ultra sound says I have ultra sound it’s only -yfor me. Now I’m like um frank you have ultra sound right, okay you have a edge, sam you don’t, Jane what were your senses again okay you get a edge. Familiarity may fix that though.

As a General rule I think 6e has less overall modifiers to remember but it’s the am I looking through edge generation or statuses section that slows me down. And while there may have been 30 modifiers in 5e 6e has like 25 edge uses to think about each action. Indecisive players big those kind of actions down.

[Michael Chandra]

Adding bonus dice from gear etc? Yes 6we still has them, but in 6we bonus dice cap out at +4

Not until errata come out.

[penllawen]

Kind of like the method penllawen and I discussed when s/he brought up the "3 piles" idea.

I’m a he, but proper respects to you for not just assuming that ISP

[Shinobi Killfist]

Adding bonus dice from gear etc? Yes 6we still has them, but in 6we bonus dice cap out at +4

Not until errata come out.

Other than adepts with improved skill who ever got 4 bonus dice anyways.

[Michael Chandra]

There is nothing in raw stating an adept with Improved Skill cannot get any other dicepool bonuses to improved skills.

[skalchemist]

...but I have 0 issues with a rigger accurately firing a guided mussels from 5 miles away.

Not to derail the topic, but that is by far the funniest autocorrect accident I have seen in a long time.  I would pay Catalyst games $5 extra for a copy of the rules if they included "Guided Mussels" as a weapon in the next printing. 

Thanks for the chuckle, Shinobi!   

[penllawen]

...but I have 0 issues with a rigger accurately firing a guided mussels from 5 miles away.

Not to derail the topic, but that is by far the funniest autocorrect accident I have seen in a long time.  I would pay Catalyst games $5 extra for a copy of the rules if they included "Guided Mussels" as a weapon in the next printing. 

Thanks for the chuckle, Shinobi!   

I just lol-led so hard the dog woke up!

[Hephaestus]

...but I have 0 issues with a rigger accurately firing a guided mussels from 5 miles away.

Well, time to go back to my exotic weapon specialist and start making custom mussel missiles... 1P damage, immediately causes the Confused status in the AoE.

[penllawen]

Keep the mussels somewhere warm for a few hours first and you can cause Nausea instead...