[Shadowhack]

I didn't see this explicitly forbidden in the CRB and I didn't get the feeling that the process of character creation is hard and fast so would it be within the rules to spend karma points on attributes and skills first before spending your priority points? That would be like 15 points to bring a skill from 0 to 2 (5 for 1, 10 for 2) and then 4 priority points to bring it to 6 where the other way around would cost 55 points to bring it to 5 (25) and then 6 (30). I have a feeling its an unwritten rule or one I forgot that you have to do it karma last.

[Stainless Steel Devil Rat]

Yeah... no spending karma on attributes while they're at 1s THEN spending attribute points.

If you need an official answer, then consider that Step 4 is where you spend Karma on attributes. Well after Step 2 where you do the priority pick stuff.

[Shadowhack]

That is what I thought. It might be a good house rule though for people who want to create prime runners...

can't blame me for trying.

[CigarSmoker]

Thats a little nitpicky even for my standards

but there you go:
p.65 in the text about Magic/Resonance (where else ... obviously)
"[...]These ratings
can be increased using adjustment points
from the Metatype column or using Karma
in the Final Touches stage."

So the Karma is supposed to be a "Final" stage

[Shadowhack]

Fair enough. I am defeated. 

[skalchemist]

Only vaguely related to the original question, but this seems to a place to mention something that is probably obvious to lots of people but was not obvious to me until I started playing around with the Priority and Karma systems.  How you spend your attribute/adjustment/skill points makes a HUGE difference in how much Karma you have to spend to achieve a target value for an attribute.

To take a simple example, lets say you have 10 points, and want four attributes to be at 6, 5, 3, 3.  If you spend the points 3, 3, 2, 2 you'll be at 4, 4, 3, 3.  You'll need to spend 5*5+6*5+5*5 = 80 karma to get to your target, which is impossible.  But if you spend your points 5, 4, 1, 0 you'll be at 6, 5, 2, 1.  You only need to spend 3*5+2*5+3*5 = 40 karma; you achieve your target with points to spare. 

Another way to think about this is that the effective Karma (eK) of an attribute/skill/adjustment point is much greater when spent to improve a higher attribute or skill than to improve a lower one.  Spending a point to turn a 5 into a 6 is worth 6*5=30 eK, but spending a point to turn a 1 into a 2 is only 2*5 = 10 eK.

The rule of thumb seems to be spend your attribute/skill/adjustment points on the things you want to have the highest values in first, don't spread them around evenly.  Rely on Karma to get the 1 or 2 extra points in low level things you need in the final stage.  I would argue this isn't "min-maxíng" (assuming that is something you frown upon, which you may not), this is just acknowledging a basic emergent property of the character creation system.

Again, I am sure this is obvious to anyone who has played more recent editions of Shadowrun. But to a person like myself who last played back around 1991, or to a person who has never played before, this may not be obvious.

[Shadowhack]

Only vaguely related to the original question, but this seems to a place to mention something that is probably obvious to lots of people but was not obvious to me until I started playing around with the Priority and Karma systems.  How you spend your attribute/adjustment/skill points makes a HUGE difference in how much Karma you have to spend to achieve a target value for an attribute.

To take a simple example, lets say you have 10 points, and want four attributes to be at 6, 5, 3, 3.  If you spend the points 3, 3, 2, 2 you'll be at 4, 4, 3, 3.  You'll need to spend 5*5+6*5+5*5 = 80 karma to get to your target, which is impossible.  But if you spend your points 5, 4, 1, 0 you'll be at 6, 5, 2, 1.  You only need to spend 3*5+2*5+3*5 = 40 karma; you achieve your target with points to spare. 

Another way to think about this is that the effective Karma (eK) of an attribute/skill/adjustment point is much greater when spent to improve a higher attribute or skill than to improve a lower one.  Spending a point to turn a 5 into a 6 is worth 6*5=30 eK, but spending a point to turn a 1 into a 2 is only 2*5 = 10 eK.

The rule of thumb seems to be spend your attribute/skill/adjustment points on the things you want to have the highest values in first, don't spread them around evenly.  Rely on Karma to get the 1 or 2 extra points in low level things you need in the final stage.  I would argue this isn't "min-maxíng" (assuming that is something you frown upon, which you may not), this is just acknowledging a basic emergent property of the character creation system.

Again, I am sure this is obvious to anyone who has played more recent editions of Shadowrun. But to a person like myself who last played back around 1991, or to a person who has never played before, this may not be obvious.

Yup, that is basically the way I do it as well. Karma is for filling in the blanks which is what it was designed for. Thanks for your examples though.

[Tecumseh]

Again, I am sure this is obvious to anyone who has played more recent editions of Shadowrun. But to a person like myself who last played back around 1991, or to a person who has never played before, this may not be obvious.

Correct, this is a well-known issue from SR4 and SR5. It's the problem of combining a linear advancement system (spending priority points during chargen) with a scaling advancement system (scaling karma costs at the final step of chargen, and once gameplay starts).

I don't mind it but some people hate it. They either choose to change chargen to a pure karma system (which is very fair and balanced, but involves a significant amount of math and can be extremely daunting to new players) or a pure linear system (no scaling karma costs during advancement).

But here are some SR6 pro tips:
1) If you have an attribute at 2, try to buy it from rating 1 to 2 with 10 with karma instead of an Attribute point;
2) Buy rating 1 skills with karma instead of Skill points; and,
3) Buy specializations with karma instead of Skill points.

[skalchemist]

But here are some SR6 pro tips:
1) If you have an attribute at 2, try to buy it from rating 1 to 2 with 10 with karma instead of an Attribute point;
2) Buy rating 1 skills with karma instead of Skill points; and,
3) Buy specializations with karma instead of Skill points.

Those are good tips!  Especially the one about specializations; it doesn't take much to see when you are playing with the excel character generator that kind user provided over in the Character Creation forum that 5 karma spent on a specialization that will come into play on more than 50% of your rolls is just about the most cost effective thing you can do with 5 Karma.