Considering how many sheets I've seen where non-hackers, who never plan on going into VR, have Scorched and Sensitive Neural Structure, and other drek like that...
First off, look at the BP points of
both of those added together. That's right, its half the value of Uncouth if they aren't hackers/Technos. Add on top of that, that there are many ways to bring them up outside of runs (possibly in runs) if you aren't playing a Missions style campaign where off-run stuff actually has time to occur. Maybe that hottie at the bar wants you to hop a moody with her over drinks and before you know it you're hooked again. Maybe that decker you pissed off last week loaded your favorite trid station with black ice. When you collapse on your couch and hop in, it slams your brain for some serious stun leaving him free to download whatever he wants to your commlink as retribution. Just because there is no intention of them going VR on the job, doesn't mean it won't ever happen, because lets face it. VR is still very much a part of the entertainment in Shadowrun, especially when you're at home.
Besides, the hypothetical "trog" hanging around the Face being his lackey is seriously limiting what the character can do during downtime. That's not "nothing", that's them being forced to actively change their play-style to compensate for the character's shortcomings.
I have no problem with things that just naturally "come up", but forcing the situation so that you corner the Uncouth character into having to resist social rolls while away from his "social buffer" is just plain bad sportsmanship.
I think you completely missed the point, again. There is a huge...very huge in fact...difference between shotgun wedding forcing an uncouth trogg to play Mr. Negotiation at a meet and forcing him to actually play the quality in the off time when he goes apartment hunting or has a mobster bump into him on the rail car home or gets mugged by the dwarf. You can say that he hangs out with the team to get rid of his weakspot, but that doesn't mean he's comfortable with the team. Uncouth characters are socially crippled, they aren't comfortable with anyone. Most people look at the flaw and think of Mr. Grouchy Surly Bastard that's Mean as a Rattler, but it's really more like Mr. Cried Himself to Sleep in the Corner Because his Friends Don't Like Him and that Hobo Looked at Him Mean. It's not a matter of Extra Discomfort so much as emphasizing the discomfort that already exists. Like making a character with Gremlins roll for things that most characters would normally automatically succeed at with no roll.
Think of it this way... someone has Severe Allergy (Shellfish) or (Mushrooms) for +20 BP. Common, yes, but easily avoided if you read the label on what you eat to make sure it doesn't have Krill or Mycoprotein(sp?), respectively. Does that mean they should have to "accidentally" get exposed to krill or mushrooms in the course of play to "pay for" the flaw?
But how easily avoided is it at a pre-served event...hosted by that mob boss...you know the one you dishonored last week when you checked out his mistress...the one looking at you like a shark stares at its prey?
Taking a flaw isn't just saying "oh this is neat". It's saying "I like this and want you (implying the GM here) to make sure it's taken into account." Do you right up a complete background for a character and think, well it shouldn't come into play at all just because I wrote it? Do you raise skills and think, well I shouldn't use those new levels just because I raised them? Do you take edges and think, well this shouldn't come into play just because I bought it? Taking flaws should be answered just like the rest. They are on your character and should come into play.
Does that mean that your character should automatically be force fed Mushrooms of Allergenic Doom by the first NPC that catches him? No, nor does it mean that Shrimp Bullets, Purple Mushroom Grenades, or Lobster Coated Sais should ever come up. It means that the flaw should, in some way, wind up presented in gameplay. Whether its a choice between offending a Mob-boss or going to the hospital, eating the mystery soup offered by your rescuers after six days on a deserted and barre island while your stomach is doing the conga or starving, or simply being unable to resist the urge of jacking your favorite BTL "Shrimp Feast 2009" every chance you get because you recently developed an addiction to your totally favorite food, the aspect should be there.
As for the social rolls... maybe it's just the fact that most of my experience on the Player end of things is from Missions, but I really don't see social rolls coming up all that much in any situation where a Face wouldn't be able to neatly step in and handle it.
Missions (run as a Living Campaign) is an absolutely horrible way to judge the entirety of Shadowrun. In order to maintain the aspects that make it a Living Campaign, it must cut things down into four hour chunks which limits the time available for most of the out of run events that other campaigns have. Most Shadowrun campaigns I've played in have much much more downtime, legwork, and general off-run mayhem than actual run time. It's just part of the biz.
On another note, remember that instead of taking Uncouth for a character, there is always the incompetent option for specific skills. A big bad trogg that isn't completely bullyable wouldn't be Uncouth. He might be Incompetent in Etiquette, Negotiation, Con, and Leadership (20 BP worth of Negatives) though. Unlike Uncouth, he can never get points in those skills without buying off the quality, but its much more playable and closer to most people idea of what Uncouth should be.
